Unreleased and New Card Discussion

[CommanderMaster999]

Well Efreets are basically just fire versions of djinns so it techanclly make sense to make them djinns

So to throw this in if there was dog to hound errata thing I would in really would have been djinn to genie since that's the most known word for it.

[Mookie]

Rounding out the last of the MH3 Commander precon cards, we have Tarmogoyf tribal.

• Tarmogoyf Nest is adorable. I'm not sure if it's good, but it is an amusing value engine, and I want to test it in my cube.
• Polygoyf is a solid beater - 3 mana for, say, a 5/6 with myriad and trample seems fun.
• Tempt with Mayhem is nonsense. The floor of a more expensive Reverberate isn't great (especially when we recently got Return the Favor), but the political implications of copying Swords to Plowshares or whatever is certainly amusing... to say nothing of bigger spells.
• Broodmate Tyrant is a bigger Broodmate Dragon. Two 5/5 dragons for 7 mana is okay, but not amazing... but encore giving you six of them for 8 mana is certainly splashy, especially if you have Dragon Tempest or other payoffs.
• Barrowgoyf gets my nod for 'most playable Lhurgoyf'. I see Nighthawk Scavenger played occasionally, and this trades in its evasion for self-mill and card advantage, which seems quite nice. I can see just running it as a value card.

[DirkGently]

Of the precons, the energy one looks fun to play but the new cards seem really niche. Like unless you're doing all-in energy they're almost all awful. Even with energy synergy a lot of them look kinda mid.

Eldrazi has a few more decent all-arounders but is also pretty synergy-heavy.

Jund has some solid cards - even the goyfs are mostly pretty viable even without any support.

The lands deck really looks like the obvious winner to me, though. How many decks are going to want Lazotep Quarry? Based on the usage of High Market and Phyrexian Tower I'd say a lot, and it has a lot of extra utility those don't. And then there's Sunken Palace, Horizon of Progress, and Talon Gates of Madara, also all very strong utility lands that could see a ton of play. And then Aggressive Biomancy is strong, Copy Land is untapped vesuva + ramp, and Rampant Frogantua is actually really strong even ignoring the +10/+10 nonsense. And that's ignoring any synergy payoffs - and Desert Warfare and Sage of the Maze are absolutely bananas if you're going down their respective roads.

Based on the new cards, my prediction is that the lands deck ends up spiking in price...kinda thinking I should maybe jump on it. Though 130nzd for a precon is rough.

edit: lol okay I just bought it on tcgplayer (I'll pick it up when I visit home in August), and hoooo boy was I off, at least with the initial price, wtffff is going on with the eldrazi precon price? People are insane, honestly.

That said, 1) even if the eldrazi cards hold value, it's not exactly a bargain unless you can find a store that somehow missed the upcharging boat and 2) I bet the lands deck will probably increase in value while the eldrazi deck drops.

[Mookie]

Based on the new cards, my prediction is that the lands deck ends up spiking in price...kinda thinking I should maybe jump on it.

I haven't bought a precon in years, but after looking at the list, I'm also quite tempted. Lots of good stuff in it, and pretty much all of the new lands fit in at least one of my decks (to say nothing of the various reprints). MTGGoldfish puts the current total price of its contents at $515 compared to the other decks all being around $300, which does suggest it will be the most valuable of the four. That price is obviously going to crash though - I see it on Amazon for $55 or so, and Planar Nexus alone is somehow preordering for $50, which simply isn't sustainable.

[CommanderMaster999]

edit: lol okay I just bought it on tcgplayer (I'll pick it up when I visit home in August), and hoooo boy was I off, at least with the initial price, wtffff is going on with the eldrazi precon price? People are insane, honestly.

That said, 1) even if the eldrazi cards hold value, it's not exactly a bargain unless you can find a store that somehow missed the upcharging boat and 2) I bet the lands deck will probably increase in value while the eldrazi deck drops.

Yea I can tell you exactly what happened with the eldrazi price after the pre sales started

Nearly all the stores jumped the gun, that would be the hype deck since that finally contains the tribe legend for it

But seeing the list it's a jokes on them thing. From the reprint value it's the smallest from all the precons. (Price likely won't drop though). Like you said the real chase deck is the simic one for reprint value and how good the new cards are in that one.

However it's the most playable without too many upgrades especially since it has one of the best mana bases from a precon I have ever seen nearly over half the deck is mana based… only 4 enter tapped.

[yeti1069]

I haven't bought a precon in a bit, and none of these look interesting to build. The discussion here had me considering the lands deck, since I do want a few of those cards, but I'm going to bank on their prices going down, and being able to pick up a single or two for a more reasonable cost.

The last commander decks I got were the cycle from LotR. I've built and maintained 3 of them, with the 4th built, but due to be officially decommissioned. The slivers and enchantment precons from Commander Masters, the Faerie precon from WoE, the dino precon from LCI, the disguise and goad precons from MKM, and the Mothman from Fallout all looked interesting, but I have been editing and playing a lot of decks for a bit, and none quite jumped out as new enough territory to warrant starting another deck. Plus, I have two Dimir decks (Yuriko and Captain N'ghathrod), an enchantress deck (Tuvasa), a morph deck (Kadena), a goad/politics deck (Marchesa), and a mill deck (Cap'n N) already. Dinos I was probably most interested in initially, but after playing with Pants on Arena a bit, it's just too linear. Slivers looked kind of the same, despite my always enjoying the creature type.

[CommanderMaster999]

Well from testing….I now know why Zhulodok, Void Gorger was not a reprint in the precon

Let's just say if Ulalek, Fused Atrocity and a copied Glaring Fleshraker are in play along with Zhulodok you can almost do infinite damage easily (esstionaly Ulalek can copy remaining cascade triggers still on the stack every single time a cascade hits a eldrazi since the raker will give you the mana to pay for Ulalek)

[DirkGently]

It's a neat interaction, but I doubt they omitted a card just because it's part of a 3.5 card combo that isn't even guaranteed to win.

More likely it's just to incentivize people to buy both precons. The RUW energy matters stuff from the fallout decks isn't in the m3c energy deck either (they are UB, but still, they could have made non-UB versions if they wanted to).

[DirkGently]

I'm bored, time to review the precon cards. Grade is power unless I think it's cool enough to give it points for being cool.

Satya, Aetherflux Genius - decent commander but not that big of an energy payoff, more of just another 3c kiki commander. C
Cayth, Famed Mechanist - kinda boring as a commander, D+
Sphinx of the Revelation - decent enabler and payoff for energy, though kinda slow on its own. B
Hourglass of the Lost - 3cmc mana rock with upside, pretty telegraphed but a decent payoff. C- but I doubt I'll play it.
Localized Destruction - sweet for 1 power commanders and decent for energy. Super crowded slot though. B- for energy, otherwise D
Razorfield Ripper - bad outside an energy deck, and just okay inside of it, but it's neat that you don't need to spend energy to do damage with it. C-
Salvation Colossus - eight energy is a pretty insane cost for the unearth, and the front side feels unimpressive too. If you want an anthem there are many better options. D
Silverquill Lecturer - cute, 5 is a lot but there's probably some wild stuff you could do with this. C+ though I don't know where I'd use it.
Aurora Shifter - there are way easier ways to get a clone, so unless you're in energy this is unplayable and even then it's just okay. D-
Blaster Hulk - man you really gotta commit to the whole energy thing to make this work. Seems like too much work for a meh payoff. D
Filigree Racer - pretty sure I remember a 5 mana dragon that gave ALL your spells FLASHBACK instead of jump-start, without the energy requirement. Seems bad F+
Aether Refinery - so hilariously weak compared to Izzet Generatorium, an uncommon. I guess you play it in an energy deck but 6 really seems excessive. D
Overclocked Electromancer - wtf is this trash. He needs to hit a creature to give you any energy, and his sink for energy is one +1/+1 counter for 3 of them? hard F, wouldn't even play it in an energy deck
Conversion Apparatus - reasonably efficient energy generator and okay sink. Probably not played outside of energy but seems fine within it. C
Stone Idol Generator - seems like an okay payoff, how good a generator it is depends on the deck but could be massive. Most for the energy deck but could see play elsewhere, C+

Overall, I like energy conceptually, but I don't think there's really been an amazing payoff for energy yet printed, and none of the supposedly energy-based commanders focus on it all that much.

Ulalek, Fused Atrocity - Hate eldrazi but seems reasonably strong, B-
Azlask, the Swelling Scourge - Really hate him, seems annoying, B-
Hideous Taskmaster - Seems annoying, damn I hate annihilator. C+
Eldrazi Confluence - pretty flexible tbh, I kinda like it. B
Eldritch Immunity - protection or alpha strike. Pretty decent but not amazing. C+
Inversion Behemoth - ability seems tedious AF to resolve, but a 9/2 for 4 isn't the worst I guess. C-
Selective Obliteration - these sorts of board wipes always suck. D
Spawnbed Protector - kinda pricey and slow but decent impact if it lives. C
Twins of Discord - Seems really mid for a 7 drop. Meh evasion and pseudo +2 power for the board isn't amazing. D
Ulamog's Dreadsire - Might have been amazing a decade ago but seems way too slow in 2024. D+
Angelic Aberration - Descent of the Dragons never really impressed me. D
Benthic Anomaly - Lot of beef on the field with some abilities. I guess if you want an impactful 7-drop you could do worse. C+
Bismuth Mindrender - For 4 this seems pretty meh. Can't see it getting it much, there are probably a lot of bad hits, and it's a potentially dead topdeck lategame. D+
Mutated Cultist - I don't think there's anything interesting to do with this card in commander. It's a niche hate card with a questionable payoff. F
Chittering Dispatcher - needing to attack is a bummer for a minotaur statline, but it does make a lot of bodies and mana if you can keep it alive and swinging. B-

Omo, Queen of Vesuva - neat idea but I don't think it gets there. D
Jyoti, Moag Ancient - same. D
Aggressive Biomancy - A lot of setup and vulnerability, but a decent payoff. C-
Copy Land - if it didn't become an enchantment it'd be a lot better. As-is, fits into some decks with critical utility lands, otherwise meh. C
March from Velis Vel - definite wincon potential for gates and deserts, if deserts was blue which it isn't. But y'know, gates at least, if it didn't always win with stupid maze's end. C-
Wonderscape Sage - build requirement aside, I don't think I'd usually want to bounce a land to draw a card unless I had good ways to put the land back down again. D
Desert Warfare - I mean, if you're in the deserts deck this looks obscene, to the degree that I'd consider building the whole deck around it. A for deserts.
Rampant Frogantua - ramping 1-2 lands on a hit is pretty strong on its own, and it gets better with buffs or if people died. B
Sage of the Maze - the absurd payoff for the gates deck. If you've got 5 gates in play, you can swing for 30 damage, wtf? And then it just also is a fine mana dork? A for gates, and a C even without gates.
Horizon of Progress - perfect for Phelddagrif, but realistically kinda slow for almost everything else. D+
Lazotep Quarry - the 3rd or 4th free sac outlet land (depending if we're counting Diamond Valley), and then it also has typing and a pretty sweet additional ability? A-
Planar Nexus - I guess this gets run as a bad desert or maybe a bad gate. I don't think urzatron is worth assembling in any commander decks I'm aware of but maybe it sneaks into colorless manabases. D
Talon Gates of Madara - real weird, but I think it's pretty versatile. B+
Sunken Palace - etb is a real downside, but the payoff looks potentially major. B
Trenchpost - don't think posts are a real thing in commander, F

Disa the Restless - the lhurgoyf payoff is strong but lhurgoyfs are mostly bad so probably not. I'd just use cheap evasive dudes and make 3x tarmos per turn. C+
Coram, the Undertaker - like the value, but attacking seems less exciting, and needing to support it with self-mill is only barely worth the effort. And limited to your own turn is a big bummer. C
Gluttonous Hellkite - decent big mana payoff as a board wipe + big creature, but I feel like I'd rather just have one or the other. D+
Broodmate Tyrant - front side is unexciting but the back half is pretty strong. Has some roles I think. C
Bloodbraid Challenger - it'll go into cascade tribal but otherwise nah, a 4/3 haste isn't a real card in this format. D
Infested Thrinax - if I wanted board wipe protection I'd just play Heroic Intervention or whatever. D-
Exterminator Magmarch - lame, no double Stone Rain. Decent card, targeting different opponents won't necessarily be your first choice but it's good value. C+
Barrowgoyf - solid little value creature for a creature-focused deck, especially one with graveyard synergy. B-
Final Act - I actually think this is mid af, none of the modes do anything except creatures and graveyards, and graveyards might hurt you more than your opponents. If this was white it'd be an F, but in black it's a C-
Pyrogoyf - MVP for Disa the Restless and changeling tribal but otherwise just decent. C- overall (A- in disa)
Sawhorn Nemesis - pretty brutal tbh. Not my cup of tea but it's definitely a major problem for your opponent. C
Siege-Gang Lieutenant - if you're in red and doing a token thing, this seems pretty strong. sac effect is weak but whatever. B
Tempt with Mayhem - I love this choice for a tempt. B
Polygoyf - sick and twisted in Ghired, Mirror of the Wilds. Otherwise it's probably a C-
Tarmogoyf Nest - pretty slow tbh. Another card that would have looked great 10 years ago maybe, and now looks like a C- at best

[Hermes_]

[Hermes_]

from the trailer video

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[yeti1069]

Why are all the morph payoffs 4 mana!?
Roshan gives your facedown creatures menace, and lets you draw a card when you turn a permanent face up.

Become Anonymous cloaks one of your creatures and the top 2 cards of your library.

Both 4 mana.

Roshan also specifically enables Etrata. We also got Vannifar, Ugin's Mastery, and Panoptic recently.

[Dunadain]

Hey, it's my two favorite magic things: universes beyond, and painfully forced typal lords! /s

Man it's been a rough run of sets for me personally, Bloom Burrow can't come soon enough.

[Lifeless]

I don't hate these designs and in fact I quite like Shay Cormac. That being said my brain will reject them like all the other UB cards and I won't remember a single one of them in a week.

[heridfel]

I foresee another UB set where green cards are awkwardly inserted into the set because there isn't much of a "nature" vibe to the setting. At least the Lord of the Rings set had enough traditional fantasy elements that it didn't have that problem.

[Ruiner]

As someone who has played a lot of these games and has a janky Kiku, Night's Flower assassins deck, I'm enjoying what I've seen so far. A lot of these cards vibe with MTG aesthetically too, except the handful of modern day cards.

[folding_music]

the end of that Desmond Miles ability would feel so much better templated as "surveil that much." and I doubt it'd confuse anyone

[DirkGently]

Glad to learn it's not full precons. Still pretty cringe but that's par for the course.

abstergo entertainment is a decent variation on Scavenger Grounds. Costs 1 more to activate and can't sac other lands, but you potentially get a card back and it has a mostly-useless filtering ability. Plus it's legendary which some decks like.

I cannot get over how much I hate the art on Desmond Miles. He looks like he should be out yachting or something. Plus his legs look weird. I assume the background is part of the game but also it looks like we're playing yugioh or something. (edit: I was referring to the alternate art version which appears on mythicspoiler, not sure how to specify that one on here)

Caduceus, Staff of Hermes looks fairly insane. I don't know why we're using 30 life as a requirement on cards that will see play only in commander. Seems like an obvious inclusion for all white equipment decks.

the capitoline triad is...interesting. The setup requirement is pretty massive, but I can't say I'm a huge fan of cards that make emblems that powerful with relatively little room for interaction. I guess play more graveyard hate. Still, I doubt many decks will want to play it considering the setup cost, plus if they're not making a bunch of tokens the emblem might not be game-winning.

mjolnir, storm hammer is very confusingly worded. Does each opponent take damage for the number of tapped creatures they control, or for the number of tapped creatures defending player controls? I think it's the latter? Either way it looks really crappy though tbh.

Templar Knight is probably going to be really expensive.

Most of the commanders look relatively tame, though Edward Kenway could make a lot of treasure by doing a bunch of vehicle crewing. Still, for the setup cost it's probably not too dangerous.

Wtf is up with the name of ratonhnhake:ton? Never mind, I don't care.

[tstorm823]

Abstergo Entertainmentmight be the card where universes beyond finally prevents me from playing a card I might have otherwise. It's a decently playable card in a vacuum, with very clean Mirror of Fate synergy, but I don't think that's enough to overcome my dislike for the theming of it.

[Mookie]

I have mixed feelings about the Assassin's Creed stuff. On one hand, there are a bunch of 'historic matters' cards I'd like for my cube. On the other hand... UB(isoft).

...anyway, stuff that stands out to me:

• The Capitoline Triad is interesting. The first emblem from a non-planeswalker, as far as I'm aware (although there are a few other, similar permanent effects). No idea how hard it is to dump 30+ MV of historic stuff in your graveyard, but it seems doable, and a strong payoff. (also: combos with Altar of Dementia similar to Hogaak, Arisen Necropolis - mill yourself, fill the graveyard, reduce cost, recast for free)
• Crystal Skull, Isu Spyglass is a nice mana rock // Future Sight hybrid. I've been testing Machine God's Effigy as a rock-with-upside in a few decks and generally been happy with it. Somehow, half of the cards in my current list for Sharuum are historic, so seems good there.
• Eagle Vision and the rest of the freerunning cards seem nice with Thada and other evasive commanders. Sort of like a commander-friendly prowl.
• Shay Cormac: 'We have heard your complaints about ward and decided to nuke it.'
• Caduceus, Staff of Hermes: 'We have heard your complaints about Serra Ascendant and decided to ignore them.'

[Lifeless]

I didn't think I cared about AC anymore after their open worlds killed the core gameplay that I loved, but seeing Desmond as mono-B gives me such a visceral negative reaction it proves that I have a little love left.

[Ruiner]

Wtf is up with the name of ratonhnhake:ton? Never mind, I don't care.

I'll answer this anyway in case someone else ends up being curious. This is the lead character of Assassins Creed 3, which takes place in colonial/Revolutionary War America. He is a Native American and that's his proper Native American name (I believe Mohawk specifically, it's been a while). In the game, he uses a pseudonym "Connor" for most it though, and that's probably what most players would remember him as or call him I'd imagine.

I get that it's "cool" they printed the card with his "real" name, but it probably should have just been Connor Kenway with his real name in quotes, or the other way around.

[5colorsrainbow]

Hey, it's my two favorite magic things: universes beyond, and painfully forced typal lords! /s

Man it's been a rough run of sets for me personally, Bloom Burrow can't come soon enough.

You do know Bloomsborrow is gonna be a typal set right*?

*As much as Innistrad is one.

[Dunadain]

Hey, it's my two favorite magic things: universes beyond, and painfully forced typal lords! /s

Man it's been a rough run of sets for me personally, Bloom Burrow can't come soon enough.

You do know Bloomsborrow is gonna be a typal set right*?

*As much as Innistrad is one.

I just meant it's going to be a setting that I enjoy, rather than detective noir or Western setting that share the trappings of said genres without having any of the actual themes of those respective genres.

[Hermes_]

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dies to Sip of Hemlock